“Europe will accept neither Ukraine nor Moldova – no one needs such a burden…” Caliber.Az interview with Georgian Professor Maisuradze

Caliber.Az presents an interview with a Georgian political scientist, professor at the Grigol Robakidze University and East European University, and the eighth member of Georgian Parliament (2012-2016) Temur Maisuradze. 

- The European Commission recommended to the Council of the EU to grant candidate status for EU membership to Moldova and Ukraine, but not to Georgia. Can this be regarded as a political decision?

- Of course, this is true, this is a purely political decision because the West demanded more from us. It wanted us to open a second front against Russia and start hostilities. Most likely, this was the demand of the Ukrainian side, which was supported by the West. Ukraine does not work independently but operates under the protection of Europe.

- What other reforms should Georgia implement on its way to candidate status?

- There are quite a lot of such reforms, but in this respect, we are ahead of both Ukraine and Moldova. We need to overcome the main divisions within society, the costs of justice and corruption. By the way, Ukraine and Moldova lag behind us in this issue as well. Perhaps these countries will become candidates for EU membership, but this is just a move to stimulate their development. However, it seems to me that Europe will ultimately not accept them, because no one wants to take such a burden on their shoulders.

Given the political situation, I believe that for these three countries the doors to the EU are slightly open, but they will never become members of this organisation. For the time being, very serious problems will break out in the EU itself, which could lead to its collapse, especially since the economic and political situation in the eurozone is very difficult. This will gradually spread to all EU countries, alternative forces will begin to act because people are very dissatisfied, they do not understand why Europe should sacrifice itself and its economy for the sake of Ukraine's entry into NATO. Too many Europeans believe that the EU should take into account the opinion of the people.

- What about Georgia's accession to NATO, how are things going in this case?

- It's not possible at all. NATO did not think that Russia's reaction would be so serious. As we remember from history, the alliance promised Russia not to expand further to the east. However, two scenarios are already possible now: either NATO expansion to the detriment of the whole of Europe, because then Russia will not stop - this is a vital issue for it, or Europe will finally realise that it is not worth expanding. I think that NATO will start to restrain itself within some boundaries, but will use soft power for greater influence.

- US Deputy Assistant Secretary of State Kara MacDonald, during a recent visit to Tbilisi, said she had brought a message from Washington expressing "deep concern about Georgia's democratic trajectory." So why is the US concerned?

- They are concerned that the previous Georgian leadership - Saakashvili's government turned a blind eye to all negative phenomena, while the current one allows itself to contradict the West on many issues. The answer to one of these questions was Tbilisi's refusal to join the anti-Russian sanctions. The West needs a government that will fulfil all its demands, for which it may well go even to the resuscitation of the former leadership.

- How do you assess Tbilisi's relations with Baku and Ankara?

- Pretty positive. We are not only neighbours but also strategic partners. Our relations are expanding and reaching a new level. It is necessary to develop relations with neighbours, because only together can we confront our opponents. From 1977 to 1979, I myself served in the Yashma settlement of Sumgayit city. Therefore, Azerbaijan is close to me, I took it as my own, Caucasian ... Yes, and we simply have no alternative - we must have very good, close ties.

- Baku had managed to resolve the Karabakh conflict. How do you assess the actions of Azerbaijan?

- Azerbaijan had exactly the same problem as Georgia – 20 per cent of the territory of our country is occupied to this day, so no one will understand you better than us. But you are great for being able to win back your lands, this deserves great praise. But in any case, both we and you will have to improve relations with our neighbours because there is no alternative to peace. Armenia will have to calm down in this regard and reorganise itself in the direction of cooperation. The confrontation will not give it anything, especially since the country is not in the best position. Armenia should make peace with Azerbaijan, just like Georgia with Ossetians and Abkhazians. A lot depends on Russia in this regard, and we will have to establish good relations with it as well. As for a new war, I very much hope that it will not happen.

- Is it possible that Russia will give back the Georgian territories? And on what terms?

- Everything depends on our further relations at the governmental level and on how Georgia will be able to take into account the interests of the Kremlin in the South Caucasus. I mean the security of Russia from the south.

- Could the 2008 war have been avoided at all?

- Of course, it was possible. Saakashvili was under the illusion that the West would help him. Ukraine thought the same way. Yes, the West is helping Kyiv, but not enough to stop Moscow. If someone thinks that everything will be fine after the destruction of Russia, then they are deeply mistaken, because in this case, a war will begin between the CIS states, and new territorial conflicts will immediately arise. China will begin to develop very rapidly, which will become a great threat to the West because Beijing can create its own stock and commodity exchanges, which will be unprofitable for the West. It is well understood there.

- Under what conditions, in your opinion, would it be possible to improve relations between Georgia and Ukraine?

- We do not have tense relations at the level of people, contradictions arose only at the level of politics. Their beginnings appeared when the government of Ukraine granted asylum to Saakashvili, who had already been convicted in Georgia. Then Kyiv began to support Saakashvili's supporters, putting them in high positions, and it so happened that Saakashvili became more important for Ukraine than relations with Georgia.

This was facilitated by the collective West, which played out revolutions in both Tbilisi and Kyiv. Ukraine recalled its ambassador from Georgia, but we could not do this. However, if the Ukrainians do not apologize to us, perhaps we will reconsider our relationship. Meanwhile, we helped Ukraine as much as we could in its war with Russia. Except for the opening of a second front and manpower, we must not forget that Russia is our neighbour, and we must not spoil relations with it.